Bloomberg播客:美国右翼基督教社区与莫斯科镇模式对比
Chapter 3: One Little Bacon-Wrapped Sausage | Our Town
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哈特福德保险公司(The Hartford)专注于帮助企业将风险控制在爆发之前。而当损失确实发生时,这项工作会与保险保障相结合,这些保障基于多年的承保、风险工程和理赔经验打造。更多信息请访问 thehartford.com/risk-mitigation。保单由哈特福德火灾保险公司及其财产和意外险关联公司提供,地址位于康涅狄格州哈特福德市。
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下载 Wise 应用即可免费注册。保持明智,选择 Wise。适用条款与条件。彭博音频工作室,播客、广播、新闻。此前在本期节目中:
I want to get back to the Ridgerunner and the the town that's being built, which I assume is a fascist Christian theocracy.
我想回到 Ridgerunner 以及正在建设的那个城镇,我假设那是一个法西斯式的基督教神权政体。
That's what the the TV news in national.
这就是全国电视新闻所报道的内容。
This has been on my mind. It's on my mind every day.
这件事一直萦绕在我的心头。我每天都在思考它。
She was determined to see what they were about. a healthy natural human way of life, the Christian way of life.
她决心看看他们的生活方式究竟如何:一种健康自然的人类生活方式,即基督教的生活方式。
The people backing these developments are very wealthy if you follow Newounding. And that takes you to Nate Fischer.
如果你关注 Newounding,就会发现支持这些开发项目的人非常富有。这引出了内特·费舍尔(Nate Fischer)。
I've put millions of dollars into it.
我已经投入了数百万美元。
And does your wife obey you?
你的妻子服从你吗?
Yes.
是的。
And why are you a Christian?
那你为什么是基督徒呢?
To fulfill that Genesis 1 dominion mandate. Fill the earth and subdue it. Take dominion.
为了实现《创世记》第1章中的统治使命。要充满大地,征服它。取得统治权。
Has Christian nationalism come to Jackson County? While Diana Naf, the Gainesboro local, was doing her deep dive to figure out who had come to her town and what they really wanted, she came across yet another podcast. It was an interview with Nate Fiser, the head of Newfounding, the venture capital firm helping build the far-right community near her home. It was pretty early on. Um Nate Fischer, he was asked by an interviewer,
基督教民族主义是否已经来到杰克逊县?当盖恩斯伯勒的当地居民戴安娜·纳夫(Diana Naf)深入调查是谁来到了她的城镇以及他们真正想要什么时,她偶然发现了另一个播客。这是一次对纽芬丁(Newfounding)负责人内特·费瑟(Nate Fiser)的采访,这是一家风险投资公司,正在帮助建设她家附近的那个极右翼社区。那是在很早的时候。嗯,当被采访者问内特·费瑟时,
tell me about the Highland Rim project. We own some land. We'll be buying more land and we're helping orchestrate moves of aligned people to the area and then it'll be a particular town where we'll actually have a lot.
"给我讲讲高地边缘(Highland Rim)项目。我们拥有一些土地。我们将购买更多土地,并协助协调志同道合的人迁往该地区,然后这将是一个特定的城镇,在那里我们将拥有大量资产。"
That town was of course Gainesboro, Diana's town. Nate Fischer being asked by a reporter, "What you're doing there in, you know, in Gainesburgh and Jackson County sounds a lot like what was done in Moscow."
那个城镇当然是戴安娜所在的盖恩斯伯勒。记者问内特·费瑟:"你在盖恩斯伯勒和杰克逊县所做的那些事,听起来很像在莫斯科做过的事情。"
Like Moscow, Idaho in the east is kind of what it sounds like.
就像东部的爱达荷州莫斯科市一样,听起来就是这样。
And he says, "Yes, there, you know, there are parallels there.
他说:"是的,你知道,那里确实有相似之处。"
A lot of parallels to that."
与那有很多相似之处。
Moscow, Idaho, a town more than 2,000 miles away from Gainesboro.
爱达荷州莫斯科市,一个距离盖恩斯伯勒两千多英里远的城镇。
Did you know about Moscow before that? No, it sent me researching and learning about Moscow.
在那之前你知道莫斯科吗?不知道,这让我开始研究和了解莫斯科。
Moscow, Diana discovered, had been the start of an ambitious experiment, a prototype. And Gainesboro, it turned out, was meant to be the next iteration. And if folks in Gainesboro wanted a glimpse into one possible future, if Ridgerunner, the developer, did plant its flag and gather its people, they could look to Moscow. It certainly gives you a precient vision of of what this could become.
戴安娜发现,莫斯科曾是一个雄心勃勃的实验的起点,一个原型。而事实证明,盖恩斯伯勒旨在成为下一个迭代版本。如果盖恩斯伯勒的居民想窥探一种可能的未来,如果开发商里杰朗纳(Ridgerunner)插上旗帜并聚集其人群,他们可以看向莫斯科。这确实让你对这可能变成什么样有了先见之明。
Precient, yes, and alarming. But from this portal into Moscow, Diana also saw another way to fight back. From Bloomberg News, I'm Maraban Knight reporting along with Susan Burfield and you're listening to Our Town. This is chapter 3, one little bacon wrapped sausage. The town of Moscow sits among the pine forests of the Northwest. In the 1800s, the town went by Hog Heaven, then Paradise Valley. Now it's Moscow, spelled like the Russian city, yet pronounced Moscow.
先见之明,是的,而且令人担忧。但通过这个通往莫斯科的窗口,戴安娜还看到了另一种反击的方式。来自彭博新闻社,我是马拉班·奈特(Maraban Knight),与苏珊·伯菲尔德(Susan Burfield)一起报道,你正在收听的是《我们的城镇》。这是第三章,一根裹着培根的小香肠。莫斯科镇坐落在西北部的松树林中。在19世纪,这个镇曾被称为猪天堂(Hog Heaven),然后是天堂谷(Paradise Valley)。现在它是莫斯科,拼写像俄罗斯城市,但发音为莫斯科。
It's home to the University of Idaho. But the town is also known for something else. Division. In Moscow, a town of about 27,000, there are two kinds of people. those affiliated with Christ Church and those who are not. Christ Church is a deeply conservative evangelical and patriarchal denomination that has royd the university town. Take a walk down Main Street. It's only six blocks and you can see the divide with your own eyes.
这里是爱达荷大学的所在地。但这个小镇也因另一件事而闻名:分裂。在莫斯科这个约有27,000人口的小镇里,有两种人:那些隶属于基督教会的人和那些不属于的人。基督教会是一个极度保守的福音派和父权制教派,它已经席卷了这所大学城。沿着主街走一走。只有六个街区,你就能亲眼看到这种分歧。
There's seemingly two of everything. Coffee shops, restaurants, bookstores. One for Christ Church members who call themselves Kirkers and one for everyone else. Sometimes you can tell this from flags or signs in the windows. All work no woke for kirkers. Black lives matter or a pride flag for everyone else. Kirker comes from the Scottish word for church, kirk. And their goal, their church's goal has always been to turn Moscow into a town of Kirkers, a town under biblical law.
似乎每样东西都有两份。咖啡店、餐馆、书店。一份是为自称“Kirkers”(基尔克人)的基督教会成员准备的,另一份是为其他人准备的。有时你可以从窗户里的旗帜或标志看出来。对基尔克人来说,“只工作不觉醒”;对其他人来说,则是“黑人的命也是命”或骄傲旗。Kirker源自苏格兰语中意为教堂的kirk。他们的目标,他们教会的目标一直是将莫斯科变成一个基尔克人的城镇,一个受圣经法律统治的城镇。
Happy 4th of July, Moscow.
莫斯科,七月四日快乐。
Celebrate your freedom. Freedom. How blessed are we?
庆祝你的自由。自由。我们是多么幸运?
My reporting partner Susan and I went to Moscow in the summer of 2025 for July 4th.
我的报道搭档苏珊和我于2025年夏天前往莫斯科参加七月四日活动。
LET'S GO. USA. USA. For the fourth year in a row, Kirkers put on their own parade right down Main Street. It was the only Fourth of July parade that day.
让我们走吧。美国。美国。连续第四年,基尔克人在主街上举行了自己的游行。那是当天唯一的独立日游行。
In years past, protesters had lined the route, but not this year. This year, it was the absence of the rest of Moscow that was noticeable. The only businesses that stayed open on Main Street were Kirker. The people who came to watch seemed mostly Kirker. Kirkers have a strong entrepreneurial spirit. They've started lots of businesses and schools in Moscow. And while Kirkers remain a minority in the town, their presence to some can feel outsized and disruptive, to others downright threatening.
在过去几年,抗议者曾沿路线排列,但今年没有。今年,引人注目的是莫斯科其余部分的缺席。主街上唯一营业的企业是基尔克人的。来看游行的人似乎大多是基尔克人。基尔克人具有强烈的创业精神。他们在莫斯科创办了许多企业和学校。虽然基尔克人仍然是小镇上的少数群体,但对一些人来说,他们的存在感显得过大且具有破坏性,对另一些人来说甚至构成威胁。
Christ Church and Moscow have been in a years'sl long battle over well almost everything. CO requirements, taxes, zoning, even this parade. And standing along the route, smiling proudly, was the man who could take credit for cleaving Moscow in two, the head of Christ Church, Doug Wilson. Wilson is tall with piercing blue eyes, a gray beard, a very grandfatherly presence. He was there alongside his wife Nancy, the church's matriarch, watching the parade go by. 50 years of hard work on display.
基督教会和莫斯科多年来一直在几乎所有事情上进行斗争:CO要求、税收、分区规划,甚至是这场游行。站在路线旁,自豪地微笑着的是那个可以将莫斯科一分为二的功劳归于自己的人,即基督教会的负责人道格·威尔逊。威尔逊身材高大,有着锐利的蓝眼睛,留着灰白的胡须,给人一种非常慈祥祖父般的气质。他和他的妻子南希——教会的女族长——一起站在那里观看游行经过。这是50年辛勤工作的展示。
Wilson has gotten a lot of attention lately inside and outside Moscow. One big reason is that he's made himself the deacto spokesperson for Christian nationalism, the movement to turn America into a theocracy, for Christians to take over everything.
威尔逊最近在莫斯科内外获得了大量关注。其中一个重要原因是他让自己成为了基督教民族主义的代言人,这是一个旨在将美国变成神权政治、让基督徒接管一切的运动。
He's one of the rare American Christian pastors who is willing to engage on questions of culture and politics. We are honored to have him. His name is Doug Wilson.
他是少数愿意就文化与政治问题展开讨论的美国基督教牧师之一。我们很荣幸能邀请到他。他的名字是道格·威尔逊(Doug Wilson)。
It's an honor to be here. Thank you.
来到这里是我的荣幸。谢谢。
Thank you.
谢谢。
This is Doug Wilson on Tucker Carlson in 2024. his first appearance.
这是2024年道格·威尔逊在塔克·卡尔森(Tucker Carlson)节目中的首次亮相。
So, I'm sincerely confused by the phrase Christian nationalism, which seems like an attack on Christianity to me.
所以,我对“基督教民族主义”这个短语感到真诚地困惑,因为它在我看来似乎是对基督教的攻击。
Um, what is it to the extent you understand it? And are you a Christian nationalist?
嗯,在你理解的范围内,它是什么?你是基督教民族主义者吗?
So, I'm willing to be a Christian nationalist because
所以,我愿意成为基督教民族主义者,因为
Okay.
好的。
Because I prefer that phrase to the phrase I usually get called.
因为我更喜欢这个短语,而不是我通常被称呼的那个短语。
What do you usually get called?
你通常被称为什么?
White supremacist. You know,
白人至上主义者。你知道,
white supremacist,
白人至上主义者,
slave advocate, you know, racist. Wilson rejects all those labels except of course Christ
奴隶支持者,你知道的,种族主义者。威尔逊拒绝所有这些标签,当然除了基督
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